IDEAS IN ACTION with Jim Glassman

Afghan Women

JIM GLASSMAN:
Welcome to Ideas in Action a television series about ideas and their consequences. I'm Jim Glassman.

Here at Southern Methodist University in Dallas, the U.S. Afghan Women's Council recently held its second conference hosted by the George W. Bush Institute. The Women's Council brings together leaders from the public, private, and non-profit sectors in the U.S. and Afghanistan to advance educational and economic opportunities for Afghan women and girls. I had the opportunity to speak with members of the council including its honorary advisor, former First Lady Laura Bush. For nearly a decade Mrs. Bush has actively championed the rights and welfare of women in Afghanistan; Dina Powell, global head of corporate engagement at Goldman Sacks, home of the 10,000 Women Initiative which fosters entrepreneurship among women worldwide; Shahla Akbari, a graduate of the 10,000 Women Initiative; and Mina Sherzoy, manager with Deloitte Consulting where she works on women's economic issues. She is founder of the first ever Afghan Women's Business Association.

The topic this week: economic empowerment for the women of Afghanistan and the countries of the Middle East. This is Ideas in Action.

ANNOUNCER:
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JIM GLASSMAN:
Women in Afghanistan have made slow but significant strides since the fall of the Taliban in 2001. More of them can now attend school, vote, and start businesses; things inconceivable only a decade ago. But many hurdles and dangers remain. Many women are still restricted to their homes, have no say in whom they will marry, and suffer from a lack of healthcare and education. With the U.S. slated to draw down its troops this year, President Hamid Karzai is negotiating an end to the warfare by reconciling with Taliban insurgents among others. But many fear the reconciliation with the Taliban will roll back Afghan women's hard won rights. How far have the women of Afghanistan come and will that progress continue?

Mrs. Bush thank you for joining us on Ideas in Action.

LAURA BUSH:
Thanks Jim.

JIM GLASSMAN:
We spoke about a year ago about Afghan women. How has their situation changed in the last year?

LAURA BUSH:
Well, last year when we talked about Afghan Women we were talking about education and literacy for girls and women. And this year we've been discussing their economic empowerment and their opportunity to be able to contribute to their economy in Afghanistan to build this prosperous economy but also how important their freedoms are for them to be able to-- be able to participate in civic life and in the economic life. I think things are better even than last year. People are all worried about the reconciliation talks, the so-called reconciliation and reintegration talks with the Taliban and you can see that especially women seem to be worried about it. They're afraid that their rights will be negotiated and you know given away really in these talks. Although what we did hear, both from president Karzai and from the Consul General and from the member of the foreign ministry from Afghanistan who came today who's a human rights commissioner is that they are absolutely not going to let that happen-- that any reconciliation and reintegration talks would include a commitment to Afghanistan's constitution which guarantees the rights of women.

JIM GLASSMAN:
And you-- In October you wrote a very powerful op-ed in the Washington Post in which you said that Afghanistan must retain-- and advance the rights of women and you know clearly you were worried at that time. Are you any more reassured by what you've heard recently?

LAURA BUSH:
I am reassured. I really am reassured after what I've heard recently. We don't know how it will turn out. But, we do know that when the Taliban was the government that Afghanistan was an absolutely failing country. And I know that most people in Afghanistan do not want to go back to that. They don't want to now still have the highest infant mortality rate and to have a totally impoverished country. So the sense that I get is they hope that if there is a draw down in U.S. troops that the U.S. does not abandon them. And that both the security situation with troops and the big sort of civil surge that's been going on to help both build the infrastructure as well as build the economy through helping women and men build their economy that that will continue. And what I see today from the Americans is that they're committed to it. The American philanthropists, and the American entrepreneurs, the 10,000 Women program from Goldman Sachs, and many other great programs, Kate Spade and their new program that they're starting in Afghanistan. They're committed to staying there and they want to see a secure and prosperous Afghanistan so they can do business there and so people can succeed.

JIM GLASSMAN:
And they're committed for the long term. One of the themes today was the importance of patience and being in it for the long term.

LAURA BUSH:
And we know from our own experience that it's very slow, that it takes a long time. We had the almost perfect document I guess that said all men are created equal but we also had slavery for probably the next one hundred years and then another hundred years before the civil rights laws.

JIM GLASSMAN:
And so much has changed in the last 9 years. I thought it was a particularly emotional experience for me and I want to ask you how you felt when today your radio broadcasts from November 2001 when you took the president's weekly radio broadcast and talked about Afghan women and this is just 2 months after 9/11. How do you feel when you look back of what you were saying then?

LAURA BUSH:
Well I'm sort of amazed in a way that things have progressed as well as they have in Afghanistan and that women are as successful as they are. I did go to Bamiyan province the last time I went to Afghanistan in 2008 and the governor there is a woman. So after only 8 years one of the provinces has a woman governor. And I think that speaks about both the courage and the persistence of Afghani women but also about their new constitution and this requirement that women also should be in involved in their governments.

JIM GLASSMAN:
Now what can Americans do to help the women of Afghanistan?

LAURA BUSH:
What we've seen is that many philanthropies, many businesses, have reached out and in many cases it's the women leadership in these businesses or philanthropies that have made it a point to reach out to women in Afghanistan. So I think there are a lot of ways people can get involved. You can look at some of the NGOs that are already on the ground in Afghanistan. You can look at our website for the Bush Institute and then also join the Women's Initiative at the Bush Center. I think we will continue to support the women of Afghanistan. George and I will for the rest of our lives and it'll be a major part of the Bush Institute as well.

JIM GLASSMAN:
And just as a last question, this was a conference on empowering women economically and also preserving and advancing their rights. How are those two things linked?

LAURA BUSH:
Well they're really linked because before, during the Taliban government, women couldn't work. They weren't allowed to leave their homes. They weren't allowed to be educated. And because they didn't have the freedom either to leave their homes or to learn to read they couldn't in any way enter the economy. And so it's very important that they have the freedom to be able to contribute to the economy of their country, to be able to contribute to the government and to the civic life just by being able to walk outside their doors, which they couldn't do before. And their rights are guaranteed in the Afghan constitution that the-- the new constitution that was written and voted on by the people of Afghanistan. So I think it's really important for all of us in the United States to know that and to continue our support for Afghanistan as it builds a democracy and then especially of course for the women.

JIM GLASSMAN:
Thank you Mrs. Bush for everything that you've done for the Afghan people and Afghan women and thanks for joining us today.

LAURA BUSH:
Thanks Jim.

[Conference Footage] DINA POWELL:
We learned through Goldman Sachs' research that the greatest way to drive GDP growth around the world was to increase the number of small and medium sized enterprises owned by women.

JIM GLASSMAN:
Dina Powell, thank you for joining us on Ideas in Action.

DINA POWELL:
Thank you for having me Jim.

JIM GLASSMAN:
Tell us what 10,000 Women is.

DINA POWELL:
Sure. It's the largest economic empowerment initiative to date. It is a program Goldman Sachs started three years ago to reach 10,000 women with business and management education, mentoring and networking, and links to capital. It really originated out of our research at Goldman Sachs titled, 'Womenomics,' and another piece called 'Women Hold Up Half the Sky,' that found that if more women entered the labor force, particularly in emerging economies, it would have a major impact on global GDP growth. And the segment that we focused on was small and medium sized enterprises - the real job creators around the world - and those that were owned by women had enormous leverage because women of course once they fulfill their potential to grow their businesses reinvest in their communities. So it's a real multiplier effect.

JIM GLASSMAN:
So why women rather than men? Men wouldn't be reinvesting in their communities?

DINA POWELL:
All the studies show that women, once they become economically empowered and independent, reinvest 90% of the revenues of their businesses back into their communities; in education programming, healthcare programming. And of course, women as the head of a household and particularly in difficult countries once they're economically empowered they also then have voices in the community. So you know what we realized was that not only was this a smart economic investment but it was really one that would have a big impact beyond the economic imperative.

JIM GLASSMAN:
And what is it exactly that you teach women in your mentoring program?

DINA POWELL:
We partner with businesses schools around the world. We're now in 24 countries providing a hundred hour curriculum that is really pragmatic businesses education; cash flow, accounting, how do you market your business, how do you prepare a growth business plan, how do you access capital, how do you build your network around you. And it's really been remarkable to see. To date, 3500 women have been in the program. We're diligently measuring the progress and we're very pleased to see that 70% of the participants have increased their revenues and 50% have created new jobs in each of the countries that we're operating.

JIM GLASSMAN:
And as far as the business schools are concerned are they in the areas where the women are running their businesses? I mean for example, in Afghanistan is there a business school in Afghanistan that Afghan women go to?

DINA POWELL:
There is and our core principle really was that we needed to make sure this model was sustainable. And one way to ensure that was to build the capacity locally so that the professors are trained in the curriculum, the curriculum and case studies are locally customized and can be taught for many, many more years and reach many more people. For us it was a terrific opportunity to work in Afghanistan through the American University in Afghanistan. This was an institution that actually Mrs. Bush really promoted and led the effort to build ten years ago and the U.S. government and private sector have come together to really bring up this institution. 120 women have already gone through the courses there, have gone through the program, and they're showing the same results that we're seeing in other countries; revenue growth, job creation--

JIM GLASSMAN:
And they're not just small business owners they're also becoming leaders in their communities and nationally.

DINA POWELL:
They are becoming leaders. We have a woman who participated in the program who has now built an NGO which is serving 5000 women and men, training them in different jewelry designs and carpentry work and she's really getting, you know, even more traction across the country now.

JIM GLASSMAN:
What about some of the obstacles, though, in a country like Afghanistan; illiteracy-- forget about the security issues-- lack of electricity and computers? There are some tremendous obstacles.

DINA POWELL:
There are extraordinary obstacles. And I think we all read about them and see them in the news everyday. It's remarkable to watch them. Sometimes they don't have electricity. Sometimes they can't get to work because of the security situation. But when you talk to them they never mention the challenges. They are so grateful for the opportunity and so hopeful for the future because they're seeing a different Afghanistan.

JIM GLASSMAN:
Thank you Dina Powell for joining us on Ideas in Action.

DINA POWELL:
Thank you Jim for having me.

[Conference Footage] SHAHLA AKBARI:
And we think that what should we do to find food for our family? My mother started her carpentry company and she employs women to do business. Besides her, I started my working with her so to find food for our family.

JIM GLASSMAN:
Shahla Akbari, welcome to Ideas in Action.

SHAHLA AKBARI:
Thank you.

JIM GLASSMAN:
What is your business in Afghanistan?

SHAHLA AKBARI:
I have a shoe manufacturing company that I produce every kind of shoes for both women and men.

JIM GLASSMAN:
And how did you start that company?

SHAHLA AKBARI:
I was working with my mother, three men came to my mom and they said, 'We can make shoes, very high quality shoes.' But they do not know how to run a business, how to start a business. So my mother said for them that, 'I have one person for you to run a business for you.' So she introduced me to those three men and then I asked them, 'I am a woman do you want to work for me?' Because in the situation in Afghanistan, the men don't want to work for a woman. They said, 'Ok no problem just we want to make money for our family. It's not a problem for us to work for a woman.' So by having a loan from my mother I started my business in May 2009 with three workers.

JIM GLASSMAN:
And then you-- you did pay your mother back right?

SHAHLA AKBARI:
Yeah.

JIM GLASSMAN:
So how many people work for you now?

SHAHLA AKBARI:
20 people.

JIM GLASSMAN:
Wow. So from three people to 20 people you said?

SHAHLA AKBARI:
Yeah.

JIM GLASSMAN:
And how many shoes do you make a day?

SHAHLA AKBARI:
28 pair.

JIM GLASSMAN:
28 pair up from how many when you started?

SHAHLA AKBARI:
When we started ,we produced one pair per day because our shoes are all handmade shoes. We don't use any machinery. We don't have any machinery to use. So--

JIM GLASSMAN:
So did you-- what kind of help did you get from the 10,000 Women program?

SHAHLA AKBARI:
When I enrolled in 10,000 program after that I learned how to run my business, how to be a leader in my company-- in my community, how to hire my employees, and how to do my financial things. And now I know how to write a forward plan-- a business plan for my business and future.

JIM GLASSMAN:
What are your hopes for the women of Afghanistan?

SHAHLA AKBARI:
I want the women of Afghanistan be like the women in everywhere. They can go to school, they can be educated, and they can go outside of the home, work inside the society like the others are working.

JIM GLASSMAN:
Thank you very much Shahla Akbari.

SHAHLA AKBARI:
Thank you for inviting me here.

[Conference Footage] MINA SHERZOY:
By the way it's in our religion. It's in Islam, the holy profit's wife, Muhammad, Bibi Khadījah al-Kubra, she was a businesswoman. She was a very successful educated trader and he worked for her. So [laughs] yeah, and then they got married.

JIM GLASSMAN:
Mina Sherzoy, thank you for joining us on Ideas in Action.

MINA SHERZOY:
Thank you very much for inviting me. Thank you.

JIM GLASSMAN:
Mina you fled Afghanistan at the age of 18 and you moved back in 2002?

MINA SHERZOY:
Yes, I moved back in 2002.

JIM GLASSMAN:
Why did you do that?

MINA SHERZOY:
We immigrated to America, to U.S., because we were forced to immigrate because of the war in Afghanistan. The Russians occupied Afghanistan and you know the whole history of the war. I was the lucky one who lived in America, who got to America, and I cherish my life in America because America gave me safety and security, education, everything. I never thought I would ever, ever go back because I thought this war would go on forever. And then right after September 11th, I think all the doors opened for everyone to go back to Afghanistan and help. So I went in March 2002.

JIM GLASSMAN:
So after you got back to Afghanistan you wanted to find ways that you could help and you went to the U.S. government with an idea?

MINA SHERZOY:
I saw the talent and the skills of these brave women, the Afghan women. I came with the idea of women entrepreneurship development. So I went to the U.S. government and I said 'I have an idea.' And with a lot of excitement, I said 'let's do women entrepreneurship development for Afghan women.' And the first thing I heard was, 'You got to be kidding. You're trying to get yourself killed, and your getting everybody else killed, putting everybody in danger,' and I came back very disappointed. Then it dawned on me. I said maybe I'll go back give and them this message that I said 'really it's in the religion, so any Muslim woman who is going to do business nobody can stop her because it's in the religion.' And they gave me a couple of days so after a couple of days they came to my office. They said, 'Let's do it. We'll give you the funding this is a great idea we have to progress.' And it was very positive since then and I started off with ten women at the Ministry of Commerce that's where I went. So with the ten women it increased to 20, 20 to hundreds of women now are doing business in Afghanistan.

JIM GLASSMAN:
Isn't there a kind of cultural resistance to women working from males? They're saying 'you know you shouldn't be working?'

MINA SHERZOY:
Yes the culture is such that a lot of men don't allow their women to go out of the home and work. When I started thinking of women entrepreneurship development to economically empower the women was to do it from home. Like the cottage industry. They can learn the skills and then they can use the skills from their homes and probably their husband could become the salesman.

JIM GLASSMAN:
You know you talk about cultural obstacles, what about some of the physical obstacles? I mean just moving goods from one place to another in a country where the transportation system isn't very good, or a lack of electricity? Tell us about some of those challenges.

MINA SHERZOY:
Transportation is a challenge especially in the provinces between the districts and the villages. It is a challenge. And one thing I've seen it in my own eyes with the Afghan women, they will do anything. They will do anything and whatever it takes in order to get to their goal. For example I know women in Kabul that are entrepreneurs, small entrepreneurs, they get their products from a village. I asked one of them once, 'How do you get to that village?' because they were doing silk scarves. She said, 'Well either I walk or we ride the horses or the donkeys. That's how we go. We knock on the door you know in the village and then we get our products and we come back.' If there is a will all the time you always make your goals, whatever it takes.

JIM GLASSMAN:
We heard today from President Karzai who was beamed into the conference by video teleconference, that he would not give up women's rights for reconciliation with the Taliban.

[Conference Footage] PRESIDENT KARZAI:
We have clear benchmarks for the peace making sure that one peace is made that the Afghan women continue to go to school, continue to participate in social and political affairs, continue to advance their economic interests in the country, and continue to gain and work shoulder to shoulder with Afghan men into the future.

MINA SHERZOY:
I believe President Karzai will do his best because he read all the statistics how strong-- how far for the past ten years women have come and the statistics were very impressive. But-- and we all know from the experiences we have had when the Taliban were in Afghanistan, they are not for women. They are against women to be in the public, in the public eye, or to work, or to be in the community out there just like they are right now. So my question is what happened in 10 years to the Talib mentality for them to accept women in parliament? Do you think a Talib will sit next to a parliamentarian woman? Do you think he will sit next to a woman in the cabinet? Or in the community? Or anything else? Or--

JIM GLASSMAN:
Or allow women to go to sch-- children to go to school--

MINA SHERZOY:
Yeah that's another--

JIM GLASSMAN:
--Girls to go to school.

MINA SHERZOY:
That's another part of it--

JIM GLASSMAN:
So you don't think the Taliban have changed in the last ten years?

MINA SHERZOY:
This is a behavioral and psychological change. They are trained that way mentally and how do you change that in ten years? That is the dilemma that everybody has.

JIM GLASSMAN:
And how supportive is the government on women's issues and women's entrepreneurship?

MINA SHERZOY:
Women entrepreneurship is a totally new concept in Afghanistan but now successful so even President Karzai talks about it now that you know women are-- have progressed so much, which is great, you know, that they're doing business at all levels. Political support lacks, justice-- judicial support lacks for Afghan Women. A women is brutalized, there should be justice. We have all the laws, very good laws, but there is no one to enforce it especially on a woman. If a woman is in trouble forget it. She would rather not go to the police, she would rather not go to the courts, because she already knows she's going to lose and her life will get worse. She would rather suffer and tolerate.

JIM GLASSMAN:
Tell us what your hopes for Afghan women are.

MINA SHERZOY:
I cannot wait to see them free. I cannot wait to see them just like any other woman in the world like especially have been in America for 25 to 30 years almost. I want them to live like I did. Like any other woman, any other human being with peace-- with peace and serenity and freedom to move. Yes.

JIM GLASSMAN:
Thank you, that's a wonderful thought. Thank you Mina Sherzoy.

MINA SHERZOY:
Thank you very much for having me. Thank you.

JIM GLASSMAN:
And that's if for this week's Ideas in Action. I'm Jim Glassman, thanks for watching we'll see you next time.

Keep in mind that you can watch Ideas in Action whenever and wherever you want. To watch highlights or complete programs just go to ideasinactiontv.com or download a podcast from the iTunes store. Ideas in Action because ideas have consequences.

ANNOUNCER:
For more information visit us at ideasinactiontv.com. Funding for Ideas in Action is provided by Investor's Business Daily. Every stock market cycle is led by America's never ending stream of innovative new companies and inventions. Investor's Business Daily helps investors find these new leaders as they emerge. More information is available at Investors.com. This program is a production of Grace Creek Media and the George W. Bush Institute, which are solely responsible for its content.